Tone on the Mfc

[Yoppappop]

And that's the balance that we all have to strike -- the balance between

being too sarcastic and potential bullies, and being sickly sweet all the

time.

 

 

 

This is true to a point -- I learned a long time ago from another forum

that I can choose to be offended or not by something that is

written. I'm the one in control of how I feel about something, how I

react to something. But you have to admit, that sometimes

emotion rules, and gets the better of you!

 

 

 

 

I'm really surprised to read this -- because to me, this place has been

amazing lately, with all the wondrous reports of Mika's shows, all the

sharing of photos and videos and personal experiences... I guess

I was so busy focusing on the positive stuff that I was oblivious to

the "negative atmosphere." Seriously, not being sarcastic here --

HAS it been so awful? Because I really have not noticed that at ALL!

 

And just to play devil's advocate a bit -- I know of some people

who have left here because they feel they have been TOO censored.

They don't like having to play by the "play nice" rules we have here...

So it's starting to sound like we can't please everyone... which really

is no surprise to me...

 

 

 

:eek: Mika's only been done with touring for

a weekend, and we have a thread like this already!

 

To be honest, I was away a lot of the weekend, so I don't know which

thread sparked this debate.

 

But also to be honest, I don't see why this subject

needs its own thread. Why not

PM the moderators when an issue arises, instead of posting something

like this and effectively punishing the whole class, like a teacher does

when someone shoots spitballs and no one confesses?

 

All this does is get the whole forum stirred up.

 

I'd like to know specifics myself -- what was said, when and who said it.

But I'd like it in a PM, not here in the thread... because I'd like the

chance to try to act as a mediator and figure out what needs to be

done.

 

dcdeb

 

i agree with pretty much all you said here :

 

- i don't know what they're talking about in fact of "bad atmosphere", i just know it's partly talking about me since... well... i don't know... i'm always close when it's about bad mood

 

- not sure of the interest of such a thread since there are other ones talking about it... and apparently, it didn't go very well in the end of those... especially when the starter with her good intentions "bullies" (ok, "teases" if you want) someone in her own thread

 

- being too censored (or feeling that i can't post what i think because people won't get it) had me away and not posting a lot of times

 

- i agree there is an intermediaire between care-bear land and sarcasm-land, but when people are used to your sarcasms, they find it everywhere, even when there is none to find... and take it as something mean... i guess we get what we deserve but well... i think it's a bit "easy"...

[FREDDIESDOUBLE]

What about some kind of mission statement? An overall direction for the forums to take so we can all have some idea of what we think would be an ideal environment at MFC? And maybe some of the structure we talked about earlier with a sub forum for the music so that some of this idle talk can be channeled in another direction and people have a place to discuss Mika's work without getting caught up in a lot of other nonsense that they don't care for.

 

I'm finding it a bit difficult to work within the vague parameters of not being "too aggressive" or "argumentative" or whatever except to just shut up and not say anything. There have been a lot of complaints that the forum has changed and it's too negative and aggressive but it would be helpful to know exactly what we're talking about here because I don't really see it.

 

I mean not on such a regular basis that it's intolerable. Flareups on a forum with thousands of people are inevitable and it's a bit unrealistic to expect things to go back to January 2007. Deano has been actively recruiting new members for months and things will explode once Mika starts touting MFC as his fan club. It's never going to be the way it was but I don't think the changes necessarily make MFC a negative and unfriendly place.

 

Well as you rightly said its difficult to comment as Im unsure of what caused this in the first place ...... So Im commenting purely on a day to day who I speak to basis ...

 

The MFC is being made official as the MFC works .... I dont want to drag all the heated arguments out of it , I dont want to destroy the culture so I/we need specifics .Not being an active MOD is tough as Im not close to it as I was....

 

I think the Mods need specifics and then go from there.....we are commenting on an unknown situation

 

btw .. Im just talking from a MFC person basis .. meaning ... I know lots of people and often ask why people are not posting and Im getting more and more the same answers

 

Its a balance of not changing a winning team . which is what the MFC is and trying to understand pinks comments for example

[Gatagordinha]

The next few months are going to be pretty trying with Mika out of sight. I don't want the board to die but at the same time it's probably best to take a break and not post here as much because it leads to that kind of thing.

 

I was thinking just the same Christine. Mika downtime can be really tricky on MFC! I'm thinking I could do with a break too. Hard though that will be...

 

Although I can't spend as much time on here as I think I do because I wasn't really aware of the people leaving due to the 'tone' problems...

 

We've had this discussion before, though, and nothing ever seems to improve long term. Perhaps this is a defeatist attitude but, that's internet forums for you..they are not perfect and mirror real life in many ways, including the unpleasant ways.

 

Perhaps if people just asked for clarification if they feel they are being attacked, it would help. If someone has unintentionally caused offence they are usually only too happy to set the record straight and clarify, or apologise. If they don't, or won't, then all I can suggest is to politely avoid that person in future if they are upsetting you. Which is what happens in real life isn't it?

[Sarah_loves_mika]

One of the best things i was taught was to 'just walk away'

 

Its SO hard to do, like you wouldnt believe, especially when you have all these things you REALLY need to say, but they'll end up being more trouble???

 

If someone personally attacks you, cant you just leave the thread, and come back later?

If someone misunderstands, can they not simply just say 'what did you mean?'

 

I know freedom of speech and all that, and everyone has the right to be wherever they want on the forum etc. but sometimes if people just pressed the "X" in the top corner of the screen, or thought twice before pressing the big shiny "send" button, it might change?

 

I just want us to get along. please? its not good for the soul.

[pinkunicorn123]

*insert smilie to express that this post is meant as no form of attack on anyone, and is simply my version of ramble on topics expressed*

 

Holy Guacamole! (*has no idea how that is spelt*)

What an essay! You totally researched and everything!

 

I get what your saying, woah for the research, didn't realise that much of communication was on other factors, but most/all of the time when things come across wrong it's not on purpose, because you can't imagine other people reading it in any way other than how you wrote it. I am a bit of an emote addict, and I hate when I've MQ'ed too much and have to go through and delete ones where I'd really prefer they stayed. They can make so much difference.

 

Eg. In Aussie thread the other day someone joked they were going to do something stupid, then someone replied "I forgive you this once :wink2:" and I thought "woah, she was only joking" (but didn't say anything, because I have a natural affinity to avoid any kind of conflict anywhere in my life, and i prefer to just ignore stuff ), the first person said "I was joking", and then the second person said "Oh me too, I should have used , not :wink2:". The smilie totally changes the meaning of the sentence, huh?

 

Another eg. In your thread about going to London, I said something about you whinging, meant it as a joke, but forgot to add a or , then you replied kind of defencive, minus any smilies, and then I couldn't tell if you were joking and had forgotten to add smilies or not, and so just did "my thing" of ignoring it and not getting into anything ... plus there was already like 2 pages of replies

 

 

 

See, this is the way I work basically every where in my life. I don't like when people fight, I don't like fighting, so I just don't

 

 

 

Lol, I never knew that. I just sort of see them as "cool-ish person, smug-ish face" - which can mean "I'm cool" or "I'm joking". (Yeah, I'm feeling rather illiterate at the moment, so I'm gonna have to stick with 'cool') Errr ... what I'm saying is that it doesn't always mean sarcastic, but when placed after a serious sentence, then it does.

 

Uuum, there was something else I was gonna say, forgot to MQ - but about people "ganging up" when someone voices something different. I don't really see it as ganging up, that first person voiced their opinion, and then a bunch of other people voice their opinion in response, it just happens that the first one had a unique one that not many others shared. What are they supposed to say .. "Yeah, I agree that Mika's left nostril is mmore elongate than the other"

I dunno, I'm thinking of in the BC gig thread as an eg, when someone said that Mika's violence scares them, and then a bunch of people (me inc.) gave their opinions of why it doesn't scare them, and it makes them like him more. I dunno if that's the "ganging up" you speak of, but I don't really see it as that.

 

Oh yeah, and language barrier. When I'm writing to my MM partner I conciously think "better not use that slang word, she probably doesnt know what it means", etc, but in the forum ... I just ... type. I didn't even think about it in this post ... *looks guilty*

 

And welcome 4once!

 

OG, I just opened another window to get that name and see three pages have been added since I started writing ... *sigh*

 

Eurgh, too many smilies - see, and now my tone will be all screwed up!

*is now replacing all :bleh :'s with 's*

 

Thanks for your post (ha! and you say i write essays!)

First to your last comment about language limitations (simple because its the last thing i read).

I agree, luckily my MM partner was american so aside from comments like 'chip shop chips' she knew exactly what i meant even when using slang.

With tomomi for example (sorry for using you here), she talks in my threads alot, and i often forget to limit my posts in terms of slang, English mannerisms and generally to keep in short and sweet and she often spends 5 or so minutes translating just a few lines to know exactly how to reply. But she has told me about this and now i try to take it into account as much as possible when we talk.

As for the the comment in the london thread, i didnt mean it in that way - i was making a quick reply as i was in the middle of two things (e.g. i am trying to reply as quickly as possible here as i have ignored a PM in a very important conversation for the last 5minutes) and therefore dont always go back and put emotes in the right places to get my tone across.

I think it is okay to discuss opinion, just to be curtious in the way in which we do it, so that we can discuss the points on both sides instead of just saying another person's thoughts have no footing.

[Suzy]

I'm really surprised to read this -- because to me, this place has been

amazing lately, with all the wondrous reports of Mika's shows, all the

sharing of photos and videos and personal experiences... I guess

I was so busy focusing on the positive stuff that I was oblivious to

the "negative atmosphere." dcdeb

 

There have been a lot of complaints that the forum has changed and it's too negative and aggressive but it would be helpful to know exactly what we're talking about here because I don't really see it.

 

 

Yeah...what negataivity?

I don't have time to read everything, except of course, I've been concentrating on Mika concert reports. Everything else is so much less important to me...(but that is what I choose to concentrate on).

I'll just continue to ignore and not participate in threads that don't do my life any good. Why would I waste my precious time on that? I have priorities in life....and better things to do. But I'm also realistic and not surprised that these things can happen with such a large forum.

[babspanky]

I was thinking just the same Christine. Mika downtime can be really tricky on MFC! I'm thinking I could do with a break too. Hard though that will be...

 

Although I can't spend as much time on here as I think I do because I wasn't really aware of the people leaving due to the 'tone' problems...

 

We've had this discussion before, though, and nothing ever seems to improve long term. Perhaps this is a defeatist attitude but, that's internet forums for you..they are not perfect and mirror real life in many ways, including the unpleasant ways.

 

Perhaps if people just asked for clarification if they feel they are being attacked, it would help. If someone has unintentionally caused offence they are usually only too happy to set the record straight and clarify, or apologise. If they don't, or won't, then all I can suggest is to politely avoid that person in future if they are upsetting you. Which is what happens in real life isn't it?

 

Thanks Gata I agree, especially the latter point.

I find that threads like this always come across (to me) as a little dictatorial and ever so slightly patronising, so I am just about to take your advice.

[FREDDIESDOUBLE]

This is the way Id like to deal with this :

 

If anyone feels they are being bullied or spoken to badly then either ignore it or use the report post button that is on each thread.That will allow each mod to look and make a decision

 

Please PM the Mods if an issue exists....

 

Personally these types of threads dont tend to solve anything and end up in a tear up

 

Mods I would close and put a system in place then move on:thumb_yello:

[Christine]

I've already lost EnFa, i dont wanna lose anyone else!!! Especially not babs!!!!

 

What is going on with EnFa? I miss her and have been thinking about her all weekend. Is she okay at least?

 

I'm really surprised to read this -- because to me, this place has been

amazing lately, with all the wondrous reports of Mika's shows, all the

sharing of photos and videos and personal experiences... I guess

I was so busy focusing on the positive stuff that I was oblivious to

the "negative atmosphere." Seriously, not being sarcastic here --

HAS it been so awful? Because I really have not noticed that at ALL!

 

I feel exactly the same as I've been caught up in the gig reports and don't really pay attention to the larger group dynamic. That's why I'd make a terrible mod because I just want to focus on the things that interest me and not be concerned with everything else going on around here.

 

I'm just not sure why everyone else doesn't do the same though. If there is a debate going on and you find that kind of thing negative and argumentative, just don't read it.

[xBillyBrownx]

I think it is okay to discuss opinion, just to be curtious in the way in which we do it, so that we can discuss the points on both sides instead of just saying another person's thoughts have no footing.

 

I think that's the esence of it all. It's a metter of respect really. I also think people need to learn to accept others and their differences simply because you can't expect everyone else to be like you.

 

I also think that people who don't speak English as their first language should be respected for being able to come here. The only reason languages exist is to enhance communication really. (sounds weird coming from someone who isn't a native English speaker, I know:blush-anim-cl: )

[dcdeb]

What about some kind of mission statement? An overall direction for the forums to take so we can all have some idea of what we think would be an ideal environment at MFC? And maybe some of the structure we talked about earlier with a sub forum for the music so that some of this idle talk can be channeled in another direction and people have a place to discuss Mika's work without getting caught up in a lot of other nonsense that they don't care for.

 

First, I know that setting up a subforum on music/lyrics is on deano's

to-do list, but I think he's been preoccupied with more pressing matters

lately. Hopefully soon he'll have a chance to address that issue.

 

Secondly, about the mission statement -- well, I've mentioned

before that we could use some very general forum guidelines

but I've been told that they wouldn't work. I'm hopeful that when

we get the new FAQ in place that will help a bit -- if people can find

answers to their questions easily, maybe they won't feel the need to start

pointless threads that degenerate into arguments or "groupthink"...

 

 

This thread is to give people some food for thought so that they might think twice before they react, so that ignorance cannot be blamed for short fuses or misread banter.

 

You're assuming that the people who you think need to see this

will see it and get that you're talking to them.

 

Instead, I think others, innocent bystanders, are going to read this and

get unnecessarily upset.

 

dcdeb

[pinkunicorn123]

This is the way Id like to deal with this :

 

If anyone feels they are being bullied or spoken to badly then either ignore it or use the report post button that is on each thread.That will allow each mod to look and make a decision

 

Please PM the Mods if an issue exists....

 

Personally these types of threads dont tend to solve anything and end up in a tear up

 

Mods I would close and put a system in place then move on:thumb_yello:

 

The intention was not to cause any upset - only to open up a forum (arf arf) to discuss it and come up with a plan, as well as preventing ignorance and in some cases, make it obvious to some members that it isnt a lone struggle and that something is/wil be done.

[Petra]

However, I think it is important that this issue has at least been yelled out to the whole MFC.

[Petra]

The intention was not to cause any upset - only to open up a forum (arf arf) to discuss it and come up with a plan, as well as preventing ignorance and in some cases, make it obvious to some members that it isnt a lone struggle and that something is/wil be done.

And I underline and highlight every word of this post. Thank you, Pink!

[pinkunicorn123]

First, I know that setting up a subforum on music/lyrics is on deano's

to-do list, but I think he's been preoccupied with more pressing matters

lately. Hopefully soon he'll have a chance to address that issue.

 

Secondly, about the mission statement -- well, I've mentioned

before that we could use some very general forum guidelines

but I've been told that they wouldn't work. I'm hopeful that when

we get the new FAQ in place that will help a bit -- if people can find

answers to their questions easily, maybe they won't feel the need to start

pointless threads that degenerate into arguments or "groupthink"...

 

 

 

You're assuming that the people who you think need to see this

will see it and get that you're talking to them.

 

Instead, I think others, innocent bystanders, are going to read this and

get unnecessarily upset.

 

dcdeb

 

It doesnt always work, i have seen some very very strict forum guidlines complete with point systems similar to driving lisences, but an idea of what is considered appropriate might help.

I realise mods/admins are very busy with becoming official, which is why it was brought up before then, not to cause upset (im not that person) but to prompt action and consideration.

[FREDDIESDOUBLE]

I dont mind it being left open , but there is a "system" to deal with this sort of thing

[pinkunicorn123]

As a last point before this gets closed and red taped.

 

To those who are saying that they have not seen these points on the forum and therefore will not change: You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus.

 

[Niki27]

Of sorry Fred you were talking to us?

 

Aerm... I wouldn't close.

I'm not for closing unless it's really necessary.

Pinkunicorn had the balls to state out loud what most people think, so why blame her?

I'd rather have a good argument and see things be settled once for all, than watch this "bad mood" infiltrate all threads on MFC and get to a stage where nothing can be done anymore.

 

I am therefore not closing.

Ask some other mod

[xBillyBrownx]

Nice! Where did you come up with that?

 

It' true indeed.

[IngievV]

With 8000 people, there's no way you can get along with everyone. Some personalities collide, that's a fact. Should bullying etc. be allowed? No. But through the internet it's hard to see what someone intends to say with a post. We all have different kinds of humor. And the main reason for the forming of cliques is, I think, because people look for the people with the same interests and humor. You'd do that in normal life too. Is it okay then that newbies are being neglected? No it isn't. I'd say if you can't get along with someone, just ignore them. Just like you do in normal life. The advantage of the MFC is that there is a special feature which allows you to block the posts of the person you don't like.

 

Oh gosh this post added NOTHING:naughty:

[pinkunicorn123]

Of sorry Fred you were talking to us?

 

Aerm... I wouldn't close.

I'm not for closing unless it's really necessary.

Pinkunicorn had the balls to state out loud what most people think, so why blame her?

I'd rather have a good argument and see things be settled once for all, than watch this "bad mood" infiltrate all threads on MFC and get to a stage where nothing can be done anymore.

 

I am therefore not closing.

Ask some other mod

 

Do i detect a hint of rebelion in you coffee?

[FREDDIESDOUBLE]

Of sorry Fred you were talking to us?

 

Aerm... I wouldn't close.

I'm not for closing unless it's really necessary.

Pinkunicorn had the balls to state out loud what most people think, so why blame her?

I'd rather have a good argument and see things be settled once for all, than watch this "bad mood" infiltrate all threads on MFC and get to a stage where nothing can be done anymore.

 

I am therefore not closing.

Ask some other mod

 

Its just a suggestion

 

The posts need to be highlighted first of all .. Im not sure if this is happening

 

I still dont know what is behind all this for example

[pinkunicorn123]

Nice! Where did you come up with that?

 

It' true indeed.

 

Who is that directed at and what about?

 

With 8000 people, there's no way you can get along with everyone. Some personalities collide, that's a fact. Should bullying etc. be allowed? No. But through the internet it's hard to see what someone intends to say with a post. We all have different kinds of humor. And the main reason for the forming of cliques is, I think, because people look for the people with the same interests and humor. You'd do that in normal life too. Is it okay then that newbies are being neglected? No it isn't. I'd say if you can't get along with someone, just ignore them. Just like you do in normal life. The advantage of the MFC is that there is a special feature which allows you to block the posts of the person you don't like.

 

Oh gosh this post added NOTHING:naughty:

 

It adds everything

For once, all opinions are valid - even those in objection.

[Niki27]

Do i detect a hint of rebelion in you coffee?

 

:lmfao:

I'm just sticking to my principles

[Petra]

The thing is that I cannot identify anymore with what is going on here (as stupid as this might sound now) - I have always liked being a member (a proud one) but I don't like what is going on here at the moment. Things HAVE changed and it wasn't only one person who noticed but several. Those that haven't are lucky. They really are and I wish I could be one of them. The problem is that I have already left the threads that I didn't like because they got worse (IMO) but I cannot stay away from every thread here because most threads are getting strange (not negativenegative but :blink:wtf:blink:strange) after some time and if I left every thread that upset me, I could also become a major fan of the smurfs and enter the SFC (if it exists) because there will surely not be discussions like here.

 

The MFC has given me so much - I found new friends, had a great time, got to understand much more of forums and things like MySpace and above all it has helped a pretty lot with getting better in English.